Arms Lore Change

[ProdigyOsi]

In the end...you will embrace the katana for PVM

Welcome to the dark side.

 

[Afro Man]

 

[Young Star]

I don't see it as a pvp nerf, just something that deepens the divide with. After 18 years it is likely unavoidably when providing new and unique content and not end up like AoS Era with ridiculous fast cast, lrc, etc. I know my gripes are very subjective. I will likely just make a new pvp dexer.

 

[eppy]

The only part i don't like about it being tied to armslore is that it does not translate to any benefit to PvP. It just further widens the gap between viable PvM templates and PvP templates. I suppose I could just forgo the armslore benefits if I want my dexer to still be useful at PvP or build a whole new pure PvP dexer. I remember that started to become a problem on OSI because it is always a much bigger endeavor to introduce something that adds to PvP and still keep things balanced. So they kept adding to PvM and then when the gap got too wide they rebalanced a bunch of stuff to make it so PvP and PvM damage was on the same scale again and most damage or other support skill bonuses applied to both monsters and players.

I am sure this will end up being an unpopular opinion but why does the armslore need to be completely tied to just the talisman? It doesn't necessarily have to be a hit chance boost on the pvp side. Just give it some benefit that puts it in the same realm as alchy, poisoning, lumberjacking, and inscription.

Yes I know armslore helps wrestling in PvP for the special moves. Maybe open that up to better control other melee skill's primary and secondary moves.

It's only a slight bump and only applicable in certain instances. You might not even need or want it.

 

[Young Star]

Yes. In the end I know this is just a slight bump and I am glad it was added as an option. I'm just grumbling about having to decide whether to drop alchy, LJ, or leave him be.

 

[girana]

The only part i don't like about it being tied to armslore is that it does not translate to any benefit to PvP. It just further widens the gap between viable PvM templates and PvP templates. I suppose I could just forgo the armslore benefits if I want my dexer to still be useful at PvP or build a whole new pure PvP dexer. I remember that started to become a problem on OSI because it is always a much bigger endeavor to introduce something that adds to PvP and still keep things balanced. So they kept adding to PvM and then when the gap got too wide they rebalanced a bunch of stuff to make it so PvP and PvM damage was on the same scale again and most damage or other support skill bonuses applied to both monsters and players.

I am sure this will end up being an unpopular opinion but why does the armslore need to be completely tied to just the talisman? It doesn't necessarily have to be a hit chance boost on the pvp side. Just give it some benefit that puts it in the same realm as alchy, poisoning, lumberjacking, and inscription.

Yes I know armslore helps wrestling in PvP for the special moves. Maybe open that up to better control other melee skill's primary and secondary moves.

what should mages say with force to use spirit speak lol


PvM templates are for PvM

PvP templates are for PvP


Thats why skilled ppl Multi Client.

 

[Kilike]

It's only a slight bump and only applicable in certain instances. You might not even need or want it.

........ Do you even play a dexxer? ANYTHING that helps with all the bullshit whiffs is 100% needed. So again, if it's so minor as you're saying. MAKE IT A PART OF THE FUCKING TALI. Otherwise buff armslore further, so it becomes a new must have skill, works on in pve, and greatly reduces misses.

Sent from my SM-G900P

 

[eppy]

No need to yell. It's a choice. That's what the 700 skill points have always required of us. You can be good at specific things. Not everything.

 

[Derwolf]

Yes. In the end I know this is just a slight bump and I am glad it was added as an option. I'm just grumbling about having to decide whether to drop alchy, LJ, or leave him be.

ez choice, drop alchy for arms lore for now. once your relic gets to lvl 10 drop arms lore for alchy

 

[Kilike]

No need to yell. It's a choice. That's what the 700 skill points have always required of us. You can be good at specific things. Not everything.

I'm perfectly ok, with my pver not being as set up for pvp. However, you just said it's a minor buff. If it's so minor, why not tie it into the tali?

Sent from my SM-G900P

 

[Afro Man]

........ Do you even play a dexxer? ANYTHING that helps with all the bullshit whiffs is 100% needed. So again, if it's so minor as you're saying. MAKE IT A PART OF THE FUCKING TALI. Otherwise buff armslore further, so it becomes a new must have skill, works on in pve, and greatly reduces misses.

Sent from my SM-G900P

 

[eppy]

I'm perfectly ok, with my pver not being as set up for pvp. However, you just said it's a minor buff. If it's so minor, why not tie it into the tali?

Sent from my SM-G900P

Because then you can still phase shift with full bonus or keep parry. You can't have everything.

 

[Kilike]

Because then you can still phase shift with full bonus or keep parry. You can't have everything.

I'll give it a shot, but if it's that minor, as you said, how about making it really worth the skill points then?

Sent from my SM-G900P

 

[Ludwig]

Maybe I'm just lucky, or don't fight hard mobs, but I don't ever seem to have constant misses and I'm an LJ

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Go fight a few ancient liches and dragons with a double axe (best DPS, I think...not sure). You will whiff 4, 5, 6 times in a row which is pretty ridiculous when you're getting hit for 30-40 at a time.

I'll be dropping LJ to try out this Arms Lore business. Thanks, eppy!

 

[TheFallen]

I feel bad for staff.

Put it something new and have it to powerful and everyone complains when it gets nerfed.

Put in something to weak and everyone complains its not worth it.

Put in something just right. .. for this community that doesn't exist.

 

[Ariakan99]

Not as minor a buff as it appears imo. Take a situation of 100 vs 100 skill and assume a 50% success chance over 1000 swings (no idea how long this would actually take on a katana)

Go to Random.org and generate 500 'hits' at whatever damage range you are usually seeing with your weapon of choice - I chose 70-100 as I assumed a slayer weapon on my max berserker.

Now assume you have GM arms lore and get the full 63% hit chance so 630 'hits'

Difference was over 11k damage. I know it will not work out exactly that way but its a decent jump depending on the circumstances you use your berserker in. Anything over gm skill (arch daemon anyone ) and its even better.

 

[TheFallen]

That is a question i want to check what is arch wrestle anyone know?

 

[wreckognize]

I'd pay 25k gold to someone to get post extensive data on how often you swing and miss or hit vs various mobs with and without the arms lore + talisman boost.

Without arms lore:

miss
miss
miss
miss
miss
miss
miss
miss
miss
miss
miss
hit
miss
games broken

With Arms Lore:

hit
hit
miss
hit
miss
miss
hit
hit
games still broken, enjoy 6x template

now give me money

 

[Ludwig]

That is a question i want to check what is arch wrestle anyone know?

Probably over 9000.

 

[TheFallen]

Probably over 9000.

Lmao no. His hp is 30k~ his wrestle i don't remember but prolly 100-120.