Boat PvP - Galleons too weak?

[Dracule]

Could we get a slight speed increase on the gargoyle galleon. I can understand the smaller boats being faster but somewhat weaker but last night we chased a dragon ship and had no chance of keeping up not even the slightest. It was like we were in 1st gear and they were in 4th. What are your thoughts on this @Dracule @Faytality

In real life the larger ships with larger sails are faster, makes no sense for a smaller ship to be able to out run a larger ship. Its impossible to kill another ship while moving so slow, some of the other ships can do laps around the garg galleon. Last night we had two ships out run my Garg galleon one guy out ran us for 15 mins and we never even caught him a friend in a Tok galleon caught him because the tok is about 4x faster then the garg lol.

 

[Dracule]

@Adam I was given an idea from a fellow shipmate about a command that clears the deck of all corpses something like "swab the deck" and it gives you a prompt message saying swabbing the deck will remove all items and corpses from the ships deck Yes or no type deal. Plus the taller/bigger the boat the farther the crows nest should be able to see just makes sense to me, the Garg galleon mass is more then double the height of the dragon ships you should be able to see double the distance or maybe like 50 tiles more.

 

[oomf]

Might as well throw this in, the meta nox relic when it spits it stops the boat but only at certain angles. Not sure is that is suppose to be the case.

 

[tader]

I'm ok with the gallons moving slower. They are much heaver and the dragons should beable to escape. However the gallons should beable to 2 shot(3 or 4 volleys) a dragon and it should take beable to take a lot more damage than it currently does. The fire rate on gallons is way to slow. For balance assuming that neither ship has a skilled captian it should take 2 dragons to sink one gallon in strait combat and one of the dragons should also be sunk.

 

[tankian]

This is just a suggestion. Be nice to have a swab the deck command to clear the deck of corpses and other stuff. @Adam @eppy

 

[Dracule]

I'm ok with the gallons moving slower. They are much heaver and the dragons should beable to escape. However the gallons should beable to 2 shot(3 or 4 volleys) a dragon and it should take beable to take a lot more damage than it currently does. The fire rate on gallons is way to slow. For balance assuming that neither ship has a skilled captian it should take 2 dragons to sink one gallon in strait combat and one of the dragons should also be sunk.

At the speed now if someone watches the horizons they can be gone before you even get close, I had a dragon ship and a tok move off my horizon map in less then a min in a dead straight chase.

 

[tader]

The problem is speed is the advantage of the smaller boats. If you take away speed and make gallons stronger then anyone with out a gallon will be as good as dead. There must be a balance. Gallons can't be the biggest, toughest, highest damage and fastest ships out there.

The above statement is assuming gallons damage and durability gets fixed. As it is now they are at a disadvantage.

 

[Dracule]

The problem is speed is the advantage of the smaller boats. If you take away speed and make gallons stronger then anyone with out a gallon will be as good as dead. There must be a balance. Gallons can't be the biggest, toughest, highest damage and fastest ships out there.

The above statement is assuming gallons damage and durability gets fixed. As it is now they are at a disadvantage.

There shouldn't be an advantage for the smaller boats i think. If they have any advantage then all the pirates will just keep using them. If they made them faster then in a couple months from now everyone will ***** I can't catch the dragon boats wtf.. they need to be the same speed. Galleons should rule the seas for the cost/time to make one, in real life what ship would be faster/stronger? a 20 foot single sail dragon boat? or a three massive sail Galleon?

Galleons should be faster, Tok fastest, orc 2nd, garg 3rd but all galleons should be faster/better ships.

 

[tader]

There shouldn't be an advantage for the smaller boats i think. If they have any advantage then all the pirates will just keep using them. If they made them faster then in a couple months from now everyone will ***** I can't catch the dragon boats wtf.. they need to be the same speed. Galleons should rule the seas for the cost/time to make one, in real life what ship would be faster/stronger? a 20 foot single sail dragon boat? or a fully armored three massive sail Galleon?

Galleons should be faster, Tok fastest, orc 2nd, garg 3rd but all galleons should be faster/better ships.

This isn't real life and that shouldn't be used as an argument. This is a game. Galleons should be able to easily dispatch a dragon boat if the catch one unaware. Galleons should be able to own their patch of water. If pirates decide that they want speed for weaker hulls and less fire power so be it.
But hey at this point we are just repeating ourselves.

 

[Fattson]

This isn't real life and that shouldn't be used as an argument. This is a game. Galleons should be able to easily dispatch a dragon boat if the catch one unaware. Galleons should be able to own their patch of water. If pirates decide that they want speed for weaker hulls and less fire power so be it.
But hey at this point we are just repeating ourselves.

As much as they cost to put together, both resource and time wise, they should be the meanest things out there.

 

[Infectious]

I also think the leveling of boats needs to be tweaked or something added.... like npc pirate ships that give alot of xp... having to sink empty boats to get level 10 is kinda boring

 

[Faytality]

As much as they cost to put together, both resource and time wise, they should be the meanest things out there.

exactly!

 

[Dracule]

This isn't real life and that shouldn't be used as an argument. This is a game. Galleons should be able to easily dispatch a dragon boat if the catch one unaware. Galleons should be able to own their patch of water. If pirates decide that they want speed for weaker hulls and less fire power so be it.
But hey at this point we are just repeating ourselves.

Well aware this is a game and isn't real life man you don't need to try and sound cool telling me lol. All I was saying is it doesn't make sense for the cheaper classic boat to be faster.. I like doing MIB's so if I want to do MIB's I might aswell ditch my Garg galleon and use a dragon ship once again? Plus the size difference just doesn't add up the larger ship's would be faster. In the end I was just saying they should be the same speed if anything.

 

[Madd Dogg]

Since pirating is a different form of PVP I would like to see all boats actually move at the same speed and just allow people to use upgrades to move faster..

there are multiple strategies to avoid attack if you are unprepared or have good loot on you. Plus with scan horizons you should see an attack with at least 15 seconds to react which is more then enough time to recall off and just sacrifice some upgrades and cannonballs..

No reason to give people a built in advantage of speed when you can avoid death easily enough as it is

 

[Tearloch]

Well aware this is a game and isn't real life man you don't need to try and sound cool telling me lol. All I was saying is it doesn't make sense for the cheaper classic boat to be faster.. I like doing MIB's so if I want to do MIB's I might aswell ditch my Garg galleon and use a dragon ship once again? Plus the size difference just doesn't add up the larger ship's would be faster. In the end I was just saying they should be the same speed if anything.

OK, as an actual sailor, I will throw this in:
Larger ships do have a lot of additional sail, however, it does not mean it is faster. The additional sail is required to account for the larger hull, the deeper draft, and the increased weight. There is a reason you don't see massive sail boats competing in regattas... Sail boats designed for speed have narrow hulls and shallow drafts. They use composite materials to reduce weight, and, yes, they have massive amount of fabric to catch the wind.
Tractor trailors have a ton of horse power, but that does mean I can blow it's doors off with my Honda Civic...

Small ships should have a speed advantage over the large ships. That is the trade off. Less guns, less armor, less capacity, but more speed. This is assuming the balancing of guns, timers, armor, hp, etc. is balanced correctly.

 

[oomf]

OK, as an actual sailor, I will throw this in:
Larger ships do have a lot of additional sail, however, it does not mean it is faster. The additional sail is required to account for the larger hull, the deeper draft, and the increased weight. There is a reason you don't see massive sail boats competing in regattas... Sail boats designed for speed have narrow hulls and shallow drafts. They use composite materials to reduce weight, and, yes, they have massive amount of fabric to catch the wind.
Tractor trailors have a ton of horse power, but that does mean I can blow it's doors off with my Honda Civic...

Small ships should have a speed advantage over the large ships. That is the trade off. Less guns, less armor, less capacity, but more speed. This is assuming the balancing of guns, timers, armor, hp, etc. is balanced correctly.

You're right its all about finding balance, but in a game where speed is king I think all of the boats should move at the same pace.

 

[Tearloch]

You're right its all about finding balance, but in a game where speed is king I think all of the boats should move at the same pace.

That is not balance, since nothing else between the ship classes would be balanced. Making all ships the same speed would mean that it would be all about fire power. This game has always been about trade offs.

Historically, pirates opted for smaller, faster ships with less fire power. They relied on their skill, and guile, and deception, to take down the larger, slower ships. If they were out gunned, and the skipper of the warship was skilled, then the pirates would run away to fight another day.

 

[oomf]

That is not balance, since nothing else between the ship classes would be balanced. Making all ships the same speed would mean that it would be all about fire power. This game has always been about trade offs.

Historically, pirates opted for smaller, faster ships with less fire power. They relied on their skill, and guile, and deception, to take down the larger, slower ships. If they were out gunned, and the skipper of the warship was skilled, then the pirates would run away to fight another day.

Except that it takes a ton of effort to make a galleon now and you can't just go buy one for 20k. The bigger boats should be far better.

 

[tankian]

all i know is that most times a smaller faster boat will win a battle. the big boats even with better guns and better stats are just to slow and slow on canon fire to. and there is no catching a smaller ship on the run.

 

[Tearloch]

all i know is that most times a smaller faster boat will win a battle. the big boats even with better guns and better stats are just to slow and slow on canon fire to. and there is no catching a smaller ship on the run.

I agree, the balance needs to be tweaked, particularly with the cool down on the larger ships' cannons. But, even if they set ship speed to be the same for all ships, there would still be "no catching a smaller ship"

I am not sure if the current system is this way, but the ship speed should be linked to health. As the ship gets damaged, it gets slower. A small ship at full health should have a speed advantage; however, that speed advantage is gone once it take s a few shots.

I understand that Galleons take a ton of time and resources to build. They should "rule the seas". But with that in mind, if you take away any potential advantage for smaller ships, then you limit the amount of players that will even attempt Naval Combat. If you need a 10M GP Galleon to even have a chance, then most players will say its not worth the effort. With a speed advantage, you allow the smaller ships a chance to get away, instead of forcing every ship on the seas to stand and fight when they are outgunned and over matched by the few players on the shard that can afford a Galleon.